water change during cycling?

Discussion in 'Water Chemistry' started by reef_guru, Apr 8, 2008.

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  1. paulg

    paulg Feather Duster

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    Ya, I think it got a little off track. Changes during cycling was the topic. I dunno, all i can speak with is from me experiences and I have had tanks set up since I was 18, so I guess you can say I have dabbled in the hobby for 19 years. When it come to cycling a tank I have never done a water change until after the whole cycle is complete. And everyone knows, people ask for advice when it comes to the cycling process but how many actually listen or take any? They will do what they want and how they think it should be. Then complain after the process when they have huge algae blooms and cant get rid of it.

    To each their own but I still see no need to do any type of water change until after the cycle has completed, again this is just my opinion.

    I forgot to mention the peeing in the tank one. My one buddy actually did cycle a tank after peeing in a cup and pouring it in his tank without any problem. I dont recommened doing it but it did work.
     
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  3. inwall75

    inwall75 Giant Squid

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    I've seen all sorts of nonsense on all of the online magazines. Often times, the nonsense was written by a famous person. So, in short, yes Reefkeeping Magazine will put up articles that aren't entirely accurate.

    I don't have any articles on there either. Is my opinion less valid? Not all of us agree on everything but at the end of the day we should close our eyes liking each other. Your statement was uncalled for and will be reported by me shortly.

    Yes, lets enjoy the weather and just CHILL!!!!
     
  4. reef_guru

    reef_guru Humpback Whale

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    ok, the question wasnt demeaning or derogatory, it was a question, and thats all. were all here for the same reason, to help others in the right way. this is a debate over a subject that has plagued reefers for years, just as lighting has. theres nothing wrong with fact or scientific results, with scientific fact to back up the answer. and as you said,
    there are many articles and discussions from people that dont know what their doing, so i agree with tangster on that one. reefkeeping is a notable site that has proven itself over the years and has valuable information.
     
  5. wastemanagement

    wastemanagement Eyelash Blennie

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    I can see sence in both sides of this debate .
    I would just like to know what it is exactly That the one over the other will benifit me the common reefer ie; WHats the long term benifits/difference.

    Oh and no water changes in the Ocean--- Ever heard of low tide and hight tide:)
     
  6. bmshehan

    bmshehan Fu Manchu Lion Fish

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    I am getting ready to do my first water change, to lower my nitrates. My tank has been running since 1/3/08. I had 2 false percs and 2 yellow tailed damsels in my tank from about 1/10 on. All lived well and thrived throughout the cycle. No need for water changes during the cycle IMO, waist of time and money. Yes, this is IMO, not the opinion of a scientist. It has worked for many people in the past and still works for many people. I don't need a scientist explaining all the confusing technical facts, I like to know the basics and know it works. If it ain't broke don't fix it. This is the way I choose to do it, it certainly isn't broke and I'm not going to try and fix it!
     
  7. Grotto

    Grotto Spanish Shawl Nudibranch

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    Why yes I have, and I'm not entirely sure how thats classified as a water change. High tides a low tides are more of a filtration then a water change.

    For example, when the tide is low in the Ocean, the tide in the bays and marshlands/wetlands is high. The marsh is a giant filter, a fascinating one at that. This is why wetlands are becoming more and more protected, because the natural ocean filter is shrinking due to man. On the flip side, when the tide is low in the bays and marshlands/wetlands, the tide in the ocean is high. Usually on "outgoing tide" or when the tide starts coming "in" on the ocean, the first mile or so of water is murky and dirty because of pollution in the bays and wetlands, and because the water is more shallow so it clouds up easily. Also, on an outgoing tide the water in the Ocean warms up a degree or more sometimes because the water coming from the bays and wetlands is significantly warmer. This is why when you're at the beach the water feels much cooler on an incoming tide because the cooler ocean water is being pushed into the bays and wetlands. But high tides and low tides are hardly a water change, more of a water shift? And this is more so natures way of filtering.

    Now, through evaporation and rain one could argue that this is the natural water change that the ocean carries out. I suppose this could be possible, but I prefer to think of my adding fresh Ro/DI water to the sump is my way of mimicking this cycle, aka rain. I love evaporation, it allows me to add this extremely pure and fresh water into the tank. In short, as are most things in life, I believe its all a matter of opinion. Going way off-topic here but I often laugh when I read that people turn off power-heads at night, honestly do tides not occur during night, does current magically go away when the sun goes down :p? But as I said before it's all a matter of opinion :)

    My apologies reef_guru.
     
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  9. Tangster

    Tangster 3reef Sponsor

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    If nitrates are an Issue just set up a coil denitrater .. I have used them for yrs and with good skimming and carbon and that I just never found a need to change water .. I honestly find that my corals do better with out them. But I have no issues with any water parameters .

    I have no data or links or have never seen any articles in a Magazine about them . Just experience with their use and few dozen people who will tell you that it took care of their Nitrate issues is all I have :) And if you want to do SPS corals Its a good idea to buy or build one and get it cycled and cured up.
     
  10. reef_guru

    reef_guru Humpback Whale

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    grotto:
    no worries, the ocean natural water change has many features i.e. melting ice caps, underwater volcanos, rain, and so on

    inwall:
    tangster stated he has written on other sites, i see no harm in asking him if he has written something on reefkeeping, since hes been in the hobby so many years

    tangster:
    some corals feed off of NO3 and its a much needed element in a system.

    most people change the water in a system to rid of NO2,3 and replenish trace elements after the dreaded "cycling". im not saying one should do water changes during a "cycle". but, can someone show me the benefits of having a toxic state of NH3,4 at any stage of a systems life? or show me the benefits of having a toxic state of NH3,4 during the "cycling" process?
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2008
  11. aquaboy

    aquaboy Panda Puffer

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    Please, hear me out, and CHILL. If it works for you let it work for you, if it dont, it dont........
     
  12. Airborneguy

    Airborneguy Flamingo Tongue

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    Does anyone fishless cycle with SW systems? I just did it with my freshwater tank, and it worked great. The biggest benefit is that you build up the necessary amount of bacteria for your full bio-load of fish, without having to stress out or kill fish in the process. I kept my ammonia at toxic levels the whole time, which speeds up the process greatly and builds up a tremendous amount of bacteria. My FW tank can devour almost 4ppm of ammonia in a matter of hours.