Sump or Trickel filter?

if you plan on going with a full reef tank a refugium will benefit the system in many ways. with my 75g sps reef i use a sump, wet/dry and a refugium. all 3 are not needed, but there is a personal reason why. the bottom of the wet/dry has live rock ( let critters hang out to eat detirus ), the top has bio balls for obvious reasons which are easily replaced over time, bio balls have a reputation for back firing. a sump with a refugium would suffice. during the initial cycling of a tank the ANN cycle is large. afterwards we are always dealing with the ANN cycle just in smaller quantities. everytime we feed the ANN cycle happens, its a natural breakdown. the refugium feeds off of the last part of the cycle and is a natural filter just like an algae scrubber. other benefits of a refugium is a more stable enviroment for the system especially pH and O2 and provides a natural food source. the refugium also adds more water to the system. having a sump allows space for extra equipment ( calcium reactor, skimmer, doser, awto, charcoal and phosphate reactor, and so on ) for a reef tank and allows more water in the system. check out the sites below.

Everything You Always Wanted to Know About Sumps, Part I by Greg Taylor - Reefkeeping.com

myth 13: Mything the Point: Part Two by Eric Borneman - Reefkeeping.com

Long-Term Considerations for a Successful Reef Tank by Mark van der Wal - Reefkeeping.com

 

ok after a lil outside research...

according to what i found a sump or trickle filter setup is more so a place to hide away yer equipment.
the dif between a trickle filter and sump is if i have a sump and attempt to use it to grow anything i will need lights over the top of it?

if i go with a trickle filter i wont need any lighting unless i add something in there that i want to grow

from what ive seen of both the sump and trickle filter if i was to buy a trickle filter and was unhappy with it i could just replace the bio balls with live rock, a couple of light mods and i have a sump.

i think im just gonna make a trickle filter and get some baffles put in there incase

 

ok so this is my rough idea on what i think will work
if i use the right algie in the fuge area it should fix and nitrate spikes

so if i were to use this system i should be pretty sweet with nitrite, nitrate and ammonia right?

 

you dont grow algae in the sump or the wet/dry, you only grow algae in the refugium. your trying to do too much in one area. the refugium will overgrow the baffles, the skimmer will have bubbles going back to the main tank, the bio ball area is to small. better to have the skimmer where the refugium so the baffles stop the bubbles. if your gonna have a wet/dry or a sump than just have a wet/dry or a sump and have the refugium seperate (less problems). and you are always going to deal with the ANN cycle. did you read my reply and go to the sites?

 

Just a thought here but I was under the impresion that the flow rates between the fuge and sump, wet/dry were sum what different.
This may also be somthink to consider if you want to be converting your systems in the future.

 

wastemanagement: totally agree
fuge: slow flow
wet/dry: return flow from main tank
sump: flow depends on set up.

 

I would trash the bioballs and move the skimmer to that section of the sump. The bioballs are very efficient at doing the job their were designed to do. Convert ammonia into nitrAte. Bioballs work well for large retail operations because they are doing water changes on a daily basis. No one wants to change water every day in their reef tank. The biological load of any system can only support a specific amount of bacteria. These bacteria will grow and multiply in the environment that best suites their needs. If you have bioballs, the O2 loving nitrifying bacteria will grow on them reducing their numbers on your LR and sand. The NitrAte produced will have to flow through the water where all your prized animals live before it can reach any anaerobic area to be converted to nitrogen gas and removed from the system. You do not want your animals exposed to this nitrAte. If there are no bioballs the bacteria are forced to live on the surface of LR and sand where they perform the same job they would on bioballs. The big difference is that they do it right next to anaerobic zones. As water penetrates the rock and sand the O2 is consumed by these bacteria and they convert ammonia to nitrate. The oxygen poor, nireAte laden water then enters the deeper areas of the rock and sand where the nitrate can be removed before your animals are exposed to it. I started in this hobby when crushed coral and under gravel filters were state of the art. I have ran just about every filter system imaginable since then. The best thing I ever did for my systems was removing the bioballs and allowing the rock and sand to do the biological filtration. If you use the bioballs you will be constantly fighting nitrAte, algae blooms, and all the other problems that cause people to leave the hobby. Moving the skimmer to the first compartment of the sump will accomplish two goals. It will give any micro bubbles produced by the skimmer time to leave the system before they get to the return pump. Placing a skimmer right next to the return pump like in your diagram will cause micro bubbles in your display. The other benefit, would be removing organics before they reach the algae, rock, and/or sand in the sump. It is better to remove these organics before they can be broken down by the organisms in the sump/refuge.
Good luck, and so far you are doing the right thing. Research, learn, and ask a lot of questions before setting up the tank. ;D

 

im fully aware that i will have to deal with the cycle
i went to all those sites and had a look
ive seen alot of sumps that had fuges in them and trickles with a fuge area for that matter i dont see how water flow could affect algie growth in a trickle filter i mean if the stuffs got water flow and light it should grow right?
there is plenty of room in the trickle filter to do all this.

-thnx (gg work)

 

ok should i go with a sump what kind of medium would i need to use and in what order would they be best placed from water inlet to water out pump?

-thnx

 

There are a couple ways to do a sump.

If you are not doing a fuge, I would go with a 200M filter sock around the drain pipe, then your skimmer and any chemical filtration if you plan on using any and then your Return pump.