Discussion in 'DrTim's Aquatics' started by Steno1911, Feb 1, 2012.
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results from this morning:
Ammonia: 4 ppm
Nitrite: over 5
I apologize in advance for the shortness on this response as I am on my phone.
Thank you for the reply. Can you recommend a test kit that will measure thehigherlevels of nitrite? API? Red sea?
Also, before adding the LR and bacteria do I need to do enough of a water change to drop the nitrites? Or can I just place them and let nature take its course.
The API kit will reading at higher concentrations. I think you can just let nature take it course. Your nitrite is not in the danger zone.
I'll answer in reverse
You either: 1) wait for the NOB to finally remove the nitrite or 2) add more bacteria or 3) do a water change, 4) combination of 2 or 3 of these
You added too much ammonia and the AOB produced more nitrite than the NOB could handle fast enough which caused the nitrite to get above 5 mg/L NO[SUB]2[/SUB]-N and the NOB have now slowed way down due to the toxicity of the nitrite
This is where we can decide if we want to argue about what's on website. I don't and I will try to make things more clear - no where in the paragraphs does it say to add ammonia every day. In fact, in numerous places it says things like
No matter if you let the ammonia or, especially the nitrite, get above 5 mg/L-N you are going to have problems, I say this many times.
yes, this is what it says - but where does it say add ammonia, even 1/2 a dose, everyday?
I am not trying to assign any blame or anything and I don't think the web site is that confusing and I say many times don't let the values get above 5 - I think you have to consider the entire article. Anyways, I will try to figure out a way to make it clearer.
You are correct; I didn't read the whole article on your website. I just paid attention to the directions which deal with fishless cycling while using the bacteria as that is the product/method I was doing.
It's very easy to deduce that the half dose is to be continued considering that you full dose on day one, half dose on day two, have no direction on days 3-4 and then can full dose again on day 5. Regardless - I've done a 50 gallon water change to help reduce the toxicity.
The worst part is that I've been building this system for 3 months and I have had EXTREMELY positive experiences with every single vender I've used. It's really unfortunate that I have had a negative experience with your product as it was the last piece of the puzzle. In the end I feel like I paid $100 for a bottle of ammonia and that qualifies me as an unhappy customer.
Here is my water test from this morning - 11 days into cycle.
Beachbreak -- I really try hard to put myself in the customer's shoes when there are issues like this and I am sorry you're unhappy but let me get this straight - you chose to ignore all the warnings about not letting ammonia or nitrite get about 5 ppm-N, you ignore the Quick Guide at the very beginning that gives basic day to day instructions and instead focus on a paragraph deep into the article to which you add your own assumptions and then when you do not get the results you want you blame the product. Basically, you're saying that you should be able to do what ever you want and if things don't work it's not your fault. Well, that's one way to look at it just not the way I choose.
Truly wish you good luck with your tank.
What I did was focus on what I thought were the directions/method for your product. Per your website: Using DrTim’s Aquatics One and Only Live Bacteria: See how it is underlined with the colon at the end. That tells me, the consumer, that this is where the instructions for using this product begins.
Never once did I say that it was the products fault. I'm sure it works as I've used other products that you had a hand in and they worked perfectly. What I did do was bring to your attention the fact that your instructions need work and you didn't like that.
What I don't like is the fact that in previous correspondence on this thread you say to buy more bacteria. Are you kidding me? One of my brand new MP40s stalled numerous times. I called ecotech for support and they insisted on replacing BOTH of the brand new units as they had been built one after another. They overnighted me two new units, had return shipping included and said sorry for the inconvenience. They knew my tank was just getting started and that I had back up pumps available but they wanted me happy. Same experience with BRS on a product. I may not be a Dr. but I have built 2 successful businesses and I'm working on my third. I know business like you know bacteria. You had the opportunity to make me happy and it wouldn't have cost you much of anything. Instead, you're arguing about interpretations of your directions and accusing me, the consumer, of placing fault at your feet. Here's a freebee: I AM THE CUSTOMER AND I'M ALWAYS RIGHT! Even if I'm wrong, I'm right!!! Had you sent out a freebie bottle of bac I would have been pleased with the outcome and sung the praises of Dr. Tim. Had you said that you could see where I may get confused and tell me that you'll amend the directions I would have been pleased. Guess what people will think when they read this thread now? Beachbreak is an idiot? Dr. Tim doesn't stand behind his product? Who knows. Either way, you had the ability to control what both I thought and others thought on this issue and that option is now gone.
Thanks for the well wishes on the new tank. I wish you well with your business.
I've read through this and It has been a really good read to me as I have have been going through a stalled cycle as well and my nitrites were not starting to convert naturally because of the levels they were at. I originally added straight ammonia to a new system and it converted to nitrites and then they got stuck off the chart and stayed there without starting to decline for 2 1/2 weeks and the nitrates were not really starting to rise at all. Someone had sent me a message and suggested that my cycle was stuck and probably wouldn't start converting because my nitrites had become toxic to the bacteria that converts them over to nitrates. What was suggested to me and seemed to get my cycle moving again was to perform a 25-30% waterchange, bump up temp a bit, and go ahead a start adding bottled bacteria to the tank as per direction on bottle, and go ahead and add a little buffer to help maintain the proper Ph. I started adding the bacteria last Sunday and kept a watch on the levels over the last week with no real change but kept adding it as per directions then yesterday afternoon went ahead and done the waterchange on tank and added buffer. After retesting everything today what I'm getting now is ammonia is still at 0, nitrites are still pretty high but not as high as pre waterchange, and my nitrates have went from10-20 ppm before WC to now they are over 80ppm I'm hoping and pretty sure this a good sign of the nitrites converting to nitrates now. I'm going to give my tank another week without testing just doing topoffs and then see what it reads next weekend which I'm expecting the nitrites to bet significantly lower or gone. Alot of the info in this post seems to be exactly what I've been going through wish I had of found it earlier because what seemed to be my answers are within it.
Just wanted to post an update.
As of yesterday:
Ammonia - 0ppm
NitrIte - 0ppm
NitrAte - 25-50ppm
Think its safe to say my tank has cycled? I have about 20G of water ready to be changed, since i think that is what is supposed to happen next. A water change to get rid of the nitrAte.
If that is the case and I am ready for fish, I want to thank anyone who contributed to the thread, but a BIG Thank you to Dr. Tim for personally responding and helping me with my issue. I certainly will be using your bacteria again when its time for an upgrade ;D
Steno911 - sounds like you're ready for fish but if you want to be absolutely sure add 1/2 dose of ammonia, wait 24 hours and measure ammonia and nitrite.
Are you going to add a lot of fish at once?
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