Nitrate and Phosphate Help

Discussion in 'Water Chemistry' started by mdbostwick, Jun 4, 2014.

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  1. Servillius

    Servillius Montipora Digitata

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    I don't currently dose vodka. I say that in the interest of full disclosure. What I propose is a temporary technique to get rid of your nutrient problem, not necessarily a permenantly solution.

    That said, look up vodka dosing. It changed my reefing life. Don't be as tentative as the instructions suggest. Start at half a ml and increase by half a week until you find your max, then halve it. If not vodka, try vinegar. I have no experience with it, but lots of folks claim it is even better.

    You need to get rid of the nutrients in your tank so you can settle into a long term maintainable mode. Doing so with GFO requires constant changing of messy GFO. In practice, people give up. Carbon dose. Trust me, carbon dosing will help you make the tank manageable.

     
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  3. Vinnyboombatz

    Vinnyboombatz Giant Squid

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    Remember MD everything you add including "cuc" adds to the problem.They all have to poop and pee.;)
    While most snails contribute very little they still contribute add to this dead and starving members and you can see how this can become counterproductive.I have found good cuc's can consist of nothing more then you.lol I have always had small cuc's. I am adding a blue tuxedo to my tank to help irradicate some gelidium i can't get rid of.My 1st member of the crew for this tank.Well beside me.:D
    .The problem is always nutrients.If wc's are your main source of removal then remove more for a while.Slow amd steady win the race.
     
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  4. FeedYourMachine

    FeedYourMachine Feather Duster

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    Ever consider an Algae scrubber?
    I have run one for years and swear by it!
     
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  5. Billme

    Billme Eyelash Blennie

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    I'm wondering MD, can you characterise the algae problem? About how much are you dealing with? 50%, 20%, 75%?. Sounds like it's cyano. Is it red, blue/green...
     
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  6. civiccars2003

    civiccars2003 Great Blue Whale

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    http://www.3reef.com/threads/attack-of-the-algae.153755/

    It was introduced into his tank from mine as he added coral, as I have been dealing with it for a very long time.
     
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  7. mdbostwick

    mdbostwick Vlamingii Tang

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    The only thing i have in my system is chemipure elite which has a small amount of gfo with carbon, so i wouldn't say i am running gfo, the only issue i have with an ats is the maintenance that goes along with its cleaning. I like to think that I would have no problem cleaning it weekly, but i am sure over time that statement would make me a liar.

    I haven't looked into carbon dosing yet, mostly because i didn't know what carbon dosing was for. If it might help in my situation, research on this is at the top of my list for today.

    I just started increasing my WCs from 10% to 20%. Hopefully this will help.

    So are you thinking my 3 fish and CUC are producing all the nutrients? Or do you think there could be another source as well?

    I have been considering it. As stated a little higher in this post, I am concerned on how the extra maintenance will effect my willingness to stick with my current routine. When I have seen pictures of the crap you clean off of those, weekly, it seems like a huge pain. What is the maintenance really like?

    It is blue/green cyano from most consensus, i would say it is between 33% to 50% now. There is a good portion growing on the sand and mostly on my rock.

    If it wasn't Cyano from your system, it would be hair algae, red cyano, bubble algae, bryopsis, or whatever decided it would thrive on my nutrient flushed system.

    My real concern is trying to find the source so I can fix that problem which would probably help out overall.
     
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  9. Av8Bluewater

    Av8Bluewater Giant Squid

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    I haven't looked into carbon dosing yet, mostly because i didn't know what carbon dosing was for. If it might help in my situation, research on this is at the top of my list for today.

    Carbon dosing is basically adding food for a type of bacteria that will eat nitrate and phosphate. Some methods that I can think off off hand are:
    Vodka $
    Vinegar $
    Sugar $
    VSV method.. ( all three )
    Prodibio Biotim $$$
    Zeovit system $$$$
    Biopellets $$

    They all require a certain level of research and care not to over do it.

    The first thing I would do is get a low range Hanna PO4 meter. Then you can judge your progress easier.
    Lots of carbon dose methods out there but you may or may not be able to get away with a GFO reactor. The high capacity GFO is great. It seems very expensive at first and it is but considering it can be regenerated 5-10 times it's not as expensive as it first seems.
    If that doesn't do the trick carbon dosing will. I feed a lot and do both.
    My preferred method would be the full prodibio system but it gets expensive. So I have a biopellet reactor I am slowly increasing amount of pellet to use in conjunction with prodibo.
    Vodka vinegar require daily doses but the price is good. If you go that route I have read there is less cyano with vinegar.
    I have run a algae scrubber and it does work. Some people enjoy the DIY stuff and the adventure of it. I did at the time but not now. The do work but not really plug and play.. needs a lot of research and attention.
     
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  10. Pete polyp

    Pete polyp Spanish Shawl Nudibranch

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    Cyano is a bacteria, not an algae. Yes its similar to algae in many ways, but its actually bacteria. I don't believe carbon dosing would help at all in this situation. Excessive carbon dosing has seemed to result in cyano outbreaks. So IMO it would only make matters worse. Carbon dosing alone will do very little to remove phosphates also. Yes many manufacturers of carbon products will claim to have a huge impact on phosphate. Users of different carbon dosing methods are giving a different story. I use to have a little red cyano pop up here and there, nothing major. I threw 10 Mexican red legged hermits in my tank and I haven't seen any since (about 8 months now). I have had no experience with this blue/green type, and its sounding like its pretty nasty.
     
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  11. Av8Bluewater

    Av8Bluewater Giant Squid

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    Proper carbon dosing absolutely will reduce phosphate.

    Note:
    You must have nitrate for the bacteria to reduce PO4.
     
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  12. Vinnyboombatz

    Vinnyboombatz Giant Squid

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    Nutrients can leach from the rocks for a long time and since we can't see them if you can just hang in there and keep the water clean enough you should see a reduction eventually.I love the ATS.This is by far the easiest(not really for nanos unless you have a sump.)and cheapest way to combat nutrients.Carbon dosing isn't for everyone but that is also an option.