High phosphates and nitrates

[quote author=Craig_Manoukian link=board=Newbie;num=1086480105;start=30#39 date=06/08/04 at 22:16:08]Increased bioload = shortend life of DSB.  

After reading this thread I concur that the bioload finally caught up with the capability of the sand bed to work properly.  This situation logically would have ocurred if the original owner would have had the tank.[/quote]

Craig,

I didn't pick up on the 3-4inch sand bed

You are my hero

John

 

[quote author=Craig_Manoukian link=board=Newbie;num=1086480105;start=30#39 date=06/08/04 at 22:16:08]Increased bio load = shortend life of DSB.  

After reading this thread I concur that the bioload finally caught up with the capability of the sand bed to work properly.  This situation logically would have ocurred if the original owner would have had the tank.[/quote]

THE DSB has only been at this location for 8 weeks now so would have gone south ... hehehee (sothdown get it?) this fast?

I wonder if the sand bed was ever taken out of the tank when it was moved to Tyler TX.?
Or maybe the left it in the tank and moved it.

Well Cindy looks like most agree here now, what are your thoughts?

Thanks
Dave

 

Hi John

John I am not sure which part your wanting me to explain but I will give it a shot, let me know if I didnt answer what you wanted.
On the calcium being poisenious. That may be a bit stronge but it pertains. Calcium inhibits molecular growth with in all hard corals. In order to have cell splitting the coral must remove or greatly reduce the amount of calcium with in its cell. Since the level of calcium with in the cell is the same as it is in the water column, they coral needs to use its energy budgit in order to remove it. What it does is to move the calcium to the outer membrane of the cell wall through the use of an enzyme, once on the membrane wall the carbonate under the tissue percipatates with it and seeds onto a seed surface, in this case the coral skeliton. A normal calcium level at 1.023 is 357, so for the calcium to be at 490 it is causing the coral to use alot of its energy budget to remove the calcium from with in its cells. This is kinda like riding the line it concerns to stress on the coral itself.
On the being a little late in the game. When I look at the situation I see a tank with some tough parameters, nitrates, phosphates and so on. this alone has been causing stress, I believe adding more alk will add to it. Thus I suggested WCing her way out of it, large WC's will reduce the levels and bring them back into play, it will also take a bite out of the nitrate and P problem she has.


Mike

 

Kudos to you Mike, Craig , Dave and John... [smiley=2thumbsup.gif]

It's sounds to me like the sandbed was a bomb waiting to go off no matter where the tank was. Maybe moving it stirred it up enough to accelerate the process, I don't know. Changing a good portion of the sand with fresh should give the bed a chance to catch up.

I don't know how good an idea it is to put in all new sand, but you gotta figure the tank is already stressed what with the levels as they are.

I don't think the fish population has anything to do with the problem.

Speaking of vinegar, it's also good for leaching ALK from newly made reefrock. After all it is acidic.

 

Great point Mike!

Oooops Mike I edited your post instead of quoting by accident! Can you please bail me out?

 

dx7fd2 I would have to lean that 23 fish in a 120 might be a little much. Looking at the nitrate and Phosphate levels its easy to say that it is definately to much for this system to handle.


MIke

 

DX how can you say that. The Nitrates were above 80.
It may not kill the fish right away but it still will stress and kill the fish if exposed to it for a long period of time.

Dave

 

You are absolutely right...

My bad, I was looking at the second reading. After the waterchange the nitrate reading was 40. I mistook that for the first reading. Actually 40 is still high, but I also think that there is something happening, or more likely, not happening in the sandbed.

Aren't there nitrate exchange media cartridges or some such that help remove nitrates? Or is that a bad chemical cure, in other words a temporary fix for the symptoms but not a cure for the problem?

I've never had that many fish in an aquarium, so I wasn't thinking along those lines.

 

Yea Dx using cure like nitrate media are pretty much just bandaids. the problem will stay until it is dealt with. You can have that much of a bioload in a tank but you have to do drastic measures in order to accomidate it. Also maintence would be unreal.



Mike

 

Hi guys!

Are all of you scientist or something along that line? I just sit here with my jaw open trying to understand everything that you are saying.

This has been a great response and I appreciate it.

Someone asked about the sand bed. When breaking down the tank , the tank guy used a large fish net and scooped up the sand and threw it in a tub. He scooped up all except the layer at the bottome of the tank and that he threw out. Rinsed out the tank. Once we got it to Tyler he again used the big fish net and scooped the sand up from the tub and dumped it into the tank. It was all mixed up and that's where I think the problem is from. I never should have used that sand but I was trusting him since he's been doing this for a long time. I was advised by someone else to use new sand. But you know how that goes, everyone has an opinion. Tank guy gave me a choice of keeping the old sand or going with new. He felt like I was making this more difficult than what it needed to be by going with new sand.  It was my choice (although I didn't know my b_ _ _ from the hole in the ground about the situation.

If everything is so bad why does imy tank look so good?  
As far as too many fish I like seeing them all and anyway what would I do to eliminate some?  My one little LFS does not do any trades, I don't know anyone in this area with a tank, and I certainly am not going to flush them down the toilet.

I don't know what else to do but do water changes and see if things come down any further and when I'm able to go ahead and change out the sand. I'll have the tank guy come down and do it . And I'll probably need a few more things installed like a chiller and maybe another pump that may run a little cooler. (Gen-x mak4 external pump)

Would it help If I got a clean up crew? I really only have about a dozen snails if that many.

Thanks for your time and the advice guys, I'll let you know what all happens.

Cindy