GSP - SPS Killer?

Discussion in 'SPS Corals' started by Matt Rogers, Feb 24, 2011.

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  1. Matt Rogers

    Matt Rogers Kingfish Staff Member

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    I am starting to get a bit paranoid about some green star polyps I have. They surrounded a slimer coral of mine and I decided to frag it yesterday after I noticed the base was now dead near the green star polyps.

    Anyone with GSP and SPS have any issues like this? I am starting to wonder if I should pull the rock with GSP out.. I am filling my tank with acropora and don't want anything irritating the acros.

    What do you think? :-/

    matt
     
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  3. steve wright

    steve wright Super Moderator Staff Member

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    I found this and thought of you -



    Eric Borneman replies on GSP and Acro contact.

    be.

    He replied:

    "No one to my knowledge has ever tested the effects of star polyps (Briareum) on Acropora, even generally. Star polyps do possess secondary metabolites, and the metabolites from the Caribbean Briareum abestinum killed a dog that was playing with one that had washed up on a beach. So, they can be potent. But, I would be more concerned with overgrowth."

    I also asked him about Acropora RTN resulting from contact with GSP. His response was, "RTN is the wrong word. The tissue sloughing is not necrosis - this is a term coined by the hobby and it is even wrong in a descriptive sense. The proper term is shut down reaction (SDR), and it is a stress-related event. I do not know if the star polyps themselves or in combination with other stressors could produce a SDR in your Acropora. I would be more immediately concerned with overgrowth that chemically-induced SDR by a healthy colony. If the star polyps get damaged or start dying, I think the chances of a chemically induced SDR would go up, so if you choose to remove them, I would do so outside of the tank. "

    In a followup email, I asked, " I was thinking that the GSP was Pachyclavularia violacea. Is that the genus and species and is Briareum the family? I'm an engineer so chemistry and biology were not my best subjects ... I did read in your book about the mis-use of the term RTN and it makes sense. I home that I don't have to experience it first hand.

    If I separate the GSP from it's current location do you think it's best to just put way off to one side of the tank and keep it away from the Acros and other SPS corals? I'm guessing that you don't put GSP in your tanks? Once I begin to separate it, do you have any ideas as to how to best stop the parts that are close to the Acro? One of the BB's said a a kalk paste but said to be careful. Thanks for the patience with my questions..."

    He replied, " Yes, since my book was published, the genus Pachyclavularia was eliminated and all star polyps are now considered to be Briareum.


    I don't put star polyps in my tanks because I find them too invasive - they are pretty, and I have kept them many times. If you put them in a tank, I suggest putting that rock in the middle of a sand patch to keep it isolated. I have no good suggestions for removal. It is very tenously attached, so I would say remove any corals on the rock the star polyps are on and relocate them first, then remove the rock to remove the star polyps, and make sure any areas where tissue injury occurs are healed before putting it back in the tank. "


    I hope this helps anyone else that has similar questions.

    Dan
     
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  4. gcarroll

    gcarroll Zoanthid

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    Think about how cool it would look if the acro was covered in GSPs. You could clain it was no acro species. Lett this be a lesson to you. No GSP, clove polyps, ect... in an advanced SPS tank. :) I's always the cheapest coral that wins the war!
     
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  5. reefmonkey

    reefmonkey Giant Squid

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    Matt I don't know if you recall the brown monti digita I posted a pic of on your sps pe thread when you were looking for close ups for the new shirt but just last week I had to totally remove the entire coral and frag it into pieces because gsp had over grown it. I ended up with less than 1/3rd of the digi and a huge gsp attached chunk that I traded along with some xenia, for a bucket of salt.
    It's overgrowing my pavona, my clam, most of of my zoa's, and even my toadstool. The latter I don't mind so much because it peels right off and makes for nice sheets to sell to area reef newbies.
    Hindsight would be that I would have isolated this stuff instead of attaching it to my main rock work had I known.
     
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  6. Matt Rogers

    Matt Rogers Kingfish Staff Member

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    OH MY. Big thanks to all. Fortunately the GSP in on one rock - but they are threatening to move on. I will put it in my sump tonight! (This is ok right? :wreck: )

    Hhahah. True. :)

    Going point sir. I seem to have to 'relearn' lessons once in a while. :p

    Holy smokes. Your post sealed it. The GSP is being yanked. Thanks for info.
     
  7. 2in10

    2in10 Super Moderator Staff Member

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    As long as the GSP is isolated it is not a problem. In you case with no sand the sump is where it should go.
     
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  9. inwall75

    inwall75 Giant Squid

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    Most people think that mainly leathers give off toxins. However, GSP gives off plenty of toxins. (That's how it is able to overtake things. Think about it, it doesn't have any nematocysts nor mesenterial filaments...the toxins are how it wins the war with other corals). If you have it in the same system with SPS, the terpenoids (secondary metabolites) it gives off are a growth inhibitor at best to SPS, serious stressor at worst to SPS. You MUST run a quality carbon and change it often. Frankly, in an SPS dominated tank, I would just trade it in for credit at your LFS.
     
  10. Matt Rogers

    Matt Rogers Kingfish Staff Member

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    Thanks for info. Trading it in sounds like better karma - would it still spread toxins if left in my sump?
     
  11. Reeron

    Reeron Blue Ringed Angel

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    I'd say yes. Any toxins released into your sump's water is going to make it to your DT's water via the return pump.
     
  12. inwall75

    inwall75 Giant Squid

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    Corailline and I are having a discussion like this. I've hypothesized that if there's no other corals putting out toxins, then the GSP's would have less (or no) need to put out their toxins. However, it's just a hypothesis.