Dr. Tims Ecobalance and Wasteaway Bacteria ?s

Discussion in 'DrTim's Aquatics' started by Thatgrimguy, Dec 23, 2011.

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  1. Thatgrimguy

    Thatgrimguy Flying Squid

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    I am curious about both of these products for my 210g SPS dominant reef.

    Dr. Tims Ecobalance Bacteria and Wasteaway Sludge Busting Bacteria.

    What exactly are the products? Live bacteria, or something that promotes the growth of these bacteria?

    How do you use it? Should I split the weekly dose down and do it slowly over the week or all at once? If it's real living bacteria I assume a UV is a no-no.

    What are the risks of using it over a long period?

    Where can I get more reading material on both products. The webpage only has a brief paragraph.

    Do any 3reefers have experience with these products?
     
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  3. Thatgrimguy

    Thatgrimguy Flying Squid

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    Also, what's the shelf life? My house is a consistent 70 year around.


    I used the Dr. Tim's One and Only when cycling my tank and it worked exactly as it was supposed to!
     
  4. DrTim

    DrTim 3reef Sponsor

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    Hello

    The shelf-life is years so not a problem there.

    Both products are live bacteria. The bacteria have been isolated from aquaria, they are not something we buy off the shelf that was made for waste-water or grease-traps in restaurants. There are no long-term problems using them.

    You should not use both products on the same day - that may result in too much bacteria in the system. Best to use 5 to 7 days apart.

    Waste-Away is a mixture of bacteria that consume particulate and dissolved organics and in the process nitrate and phosphate. The benefit is that they can get into the substrate, live rock and all the places you can't reach to degrade the organics. Waste-Away should be used on a regular basis to keep your system clean.

    Eco-Balance is a mixture of probiotic bacteria. Now probiotic is becoming a buzz word and mis-applied by many manufactures and hobbyists. Ours are true probiotics in that they convene a health effect - they produce a substance that inhibits the growth of other (bad) bacteria like Vibrio and they work by competitive exclusion to stop (bad) bacteria from colonizing sites which can lead to infection. Eco-Balance should be applied once every month or two weeks.

    As for UV - yes, UV will reduce the effectiveness of these products - I recommend turning the uV off for 48 hours after applying the bacteria.

    hope this helps

    Merry Christmas

    DrTim
     
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  5. Thatgrimguy

    Thatgrimguy Flying Squid

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    When using the EcoBalance product. Is it best to dose all at once or to slowly dose it over the coarse of a day or even week?
     
  6. DrTim

    DrTim 3reef Sponsor

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    Truthfully, I don't have any data that says one way or another but it seems to me that is would be best to dose slowly over time because your skimmer is constantly removing bacteria from the water which is both good and bad. So by slowly adding the Eco-Balance you give the bacteria time to reproduce and do their thing.

    Maybe someone else has a counter point?

    I do know that Mike from Stewart's Frag Farm does the following with the Waste-Away with great success: He takes a gallon of tank water, adds 1.3 oz Waste-Away and 1/4 teaspoon of our First Defense and put this in container - he keeps this aerated. He then takes about 1 liter of this solution and puts it in a gravity doser and lets it drip into his system at about 3-9 ml per minute at night. He does this 6 nights a week and his corals have much better color and the rock and coral substrate are much cleaner.
     
  7. m2434

    m2434 Giant Squid

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    Well, I can always do counter arguments, whether correct or not I don't know :) It seems to me that skimmer efficiency is an important factor though.

    Say, we assume that the bacteria will double every day and say that the skimmer removes 30% per day. If we add 10 bacteria per day, for 10 days, we have 10 the first day and 0.7*(previous day count)*2+10 for the following days. So, if we plug this into excel, after 10 days we have ~698. If we add 100 at once, then we have 100 the first day, then .7*(previous day count) * 2. So, after 10 days, we have ~2066. So, more with one dose at once.

    When we hit 50% removal, then we have 100 each after 10 days.

    And < 50% then there is more if we spread out the dose over multiple days vs all at once. For example, if we assume 70% removal, we'd have about 25 if dosed over 10 days, vs ~1 if dosed at once. Of course then, once dosing is stopped the daily dose group would start to decline as well. So, hopefully this isn't the case...

    Then there are things like nutrient limitation, linearity of skimmer performance, biofilm formation etc.. that would need to be factored in. So, really I have no idea :lol:
     
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  9. DrTim

    DrTim 3reef Sponsor

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    you're right that much depends on the skimmer efficiency. also the reproduction rate of the bacteria is 20 to 30 minutes (under good conditions) which is why hey can turn a tank cloudy pretty fast.

    the idea is to dose enough to keep a relatively constant supply of bacteria in the system - try to balance inputs and output. i highly encourage everyone to read this article - (hope it's ok to post the link here) as it provides data that shows our reef aquaria are low, compared to natural reef, in bacteria which are an important component.
     
  10. Thatgrimguy

    Thatgrimguy Flying Squid

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    So, a slow dosing method seems to be the best course of action.
     
  11. DrTim

    DrTim 3reef Sponsor

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    Yes, I believe a slow dose in the best course.
     
  12. Thatgrimguy

    Thatgrimguy Flying Squid

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    I should be getting both products in today or tomorrow!! And for anyone reading this! Not only did I get a great discount for the holidays and being a 3reef member (35%!!) but I ended up getting a refund for part of my shipping!!


    Great business Dr. Tim!!