Discussion in 'Clams' started by mad_kangaroo, Jul 5, 2007.
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LOL you are making my point for me, Clams can not survive on photosynthesis alone
Then why diden't you just tell him don't add any :
Ahem...what was the question again?
I don't mind a little debate guys and gals but this has gotten ugly. I'm hoping that I won't have to close this thread but I will if things keep going in this direction.
Sorry MOM ;D :-[ I'll be good I think I made my point anyway :
amcarrig please don't take that as being sarcastic toward you as I would never do that
I always say you can't buy or sell common sense.. Now all I'll ask is why do clams ingest water and exhaust water ? Light particles ? maybe someone will do study on that ? Its been proved over and over again you put Clams oyster scallops in to phosphate and silicate plankton laden water and they under controlled condition will filter it clean and improve the water quality . But then again you have to apply common sense no poisons and pollutants that would kill them.
there is a big difference between clams extracting N&P from water and filter feeding. clams have the ability to adsorb nutrients(N&P) right through there mantle tissue and pass it to the zoox.the zoox use this for photosynthesis and then feed the clam. this is done with out the clam ever needing to "filter" anything. these nutrientes im talking about are not particulate matter they are dissolved=part of the water=cant be filtered
what dont you get from the first link i posted? that study was done using very small clam(the kind that everyone says will die if you dont feed them phyto) these clams were kept in microfiltered water never receiving any particulate. the clams clearly lived and grew for the duration of the study(10 or 11 months i think it was)
"Then why diden't you just tell him don't add any"
because they already had it and were asking how it should be added. i was answering the question asked.
"I always say you can't buy or sell common sense.. "
thats funny, didnt you just recommend to someone that didnt understand the basic relationship between PH and Alk to run there Alk between 14 and 16dkh?
extracting dissolved nutrients (nitrogen and phosphorus) directly from the water is not filter feeding. capturing particulate matter from the water is filter feeding. that first link clearly shows clams can live and grow with out filter feeding period
yes I did tell someone to run their DKH at that level and also suggested their Ca be at 450 Plus., All who have tied it find that is does very well. But lets stay on subject here Clams
You are willing to say right here and now that tridacnid's do not ingest or eat phytoplankton or even zooplankton and detritus that they filter from the water ?
please reread my posts. the issue isnt that they DONT or CANT filter feed, i have NEVER said that. the issue is that people always state that clams under a certain size can not sustain them selves on light alone=if you dont feed them phyto they will die. they also say that there mantles aren't fully developed. false, there mantles are fully developed with in days of metamorphosis. they say that there mantles are not large enough to house enough zoox to support the clam. also false, a clams mantle is proportionate to its size through out its life
our aquariums are inherently much more nutrient rich then the ocean these clams come from. why do you think people spend so much money on skimmers and phosphate removers. the reason i even get into these kind of conversations is because i see some many times where people get a clam and believe that if they dont feed it phytoplankton it will die. so they get phyto and add it to the tank and in a month or two you see them asking how to get rid of there hair algae. then they are spending more money on another skimmer or PO4 reactor ect...
clams need N&P just like anything else but in the typical home aquarium there is plenty
im very willing to stay on topic but dont insinuate that i dont have common sense. there have been many experienced aquarists that have tried running there tanks at these elevated levels and had disastrous results. to advise someone that doesn't understand the basic relationship between Ph, Ca & Alk to do this is irresponsible
There have been articles and books stating that "gem" sized clams should be fed food as a reliance more so than light, so this isn't any false statement I made. Having said this, I am glad if this statement is totally true that baby clams don't just need to be fed nanoplankton etc. to survive!
I do know that clams feed on nitrates and ammonium...which is mainly the reason for my clam success now with starting with bigger clams.
I have tried to keep clams less than 2" in size and they always died, and they were under halide lighting! Since getting larger clams to start I have had nothing but success!!
But thanks for the insight, as we are always trying to learn, experiment and be successful reefers!
Thanks guys and gals!
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