My experiences with cupramine so far

I had posted a while ago that I am quarantining all my fish for 8 wks to rid my tank of ich. I currently have 6 fish in a 30g QT, treating with seachem's cupramine. Filtering with an emperor 400 filter with biowheel, and sponge filter. I also have a bag of seachem's Matrix product for extra surface area for bacterial colonization.

Experiences with cupramine so far - fish all tolerating it well, no sign of any white spots after one week. Fish all eating, seem ok. But, my big problem with cupramine is that you can't use any ammonia/nitrite reducing chemicals with it, or it makes the cupramine toxic. Because of this, I am having to do CONSTANT water changes to rid my tank of the ammonia and nitrite that are building up in it very quickly. Doing 50% water changes every 2 days, and even so my nitrite levels are 0.25 (too much, I know). I tried adding seachem Stability, but it doesn't seem to be doing much. I also tried letting the fliter media sit in my DT sump for a few days to pick up bacteria....not helping much. I think that, if I had to do it again, I would probably use a different product other than cupramine - one that I could use along with a nitrite-reducing product. It would have saved me a lot of trouble with constant water changing.

Sorry for the long post, but maybe it might help someone else in the future.

 

Good to know..but this kind of caught my eye..

You didn't put the media that had already been running in the QT in your sump did you?

 

Good point - of course not. That would have contaminated my DT with copper. No, I took new filter media, put it in my sump for a few days, and then put it in the filter of the QT.

 

okay! juuust making sure!

 

You can quarantine them all you want if its truly Ick then you will never stop the out breaks . Anyone who says they have been in the marine fish hobby for more then day and have kept certain fish species and they say they never had a out break of common marine ick then they would be great used car salesmen.. I have had tanks go 5 yrs nothing new added or removed other then coral clipping and one day they where fine the next all where dusted with the pest.. Stress causes the problem and removing them from the display tank and tossing them in a smalled and strange tank just kicks the stress level up a notch and sends the problem into over drive..

Unless I'm 100% certain of the place I have gotten any corals in from then I'd quarantine them and look them over well for a few weeks or months the make sure they are clean and healthy , but as for a fish ? Last time I quarantine one was 30 plus yrs ago.

 

You may well be right, Tangster. I know you have much more experience than I do. But I have heard so many conflicting opinions/reports on this topic of ich, and my fish were getting so sick for so long, that I felt I had to try this approach at least.

Just from my basic knowledge of the biology of the parasite, it should theoretically be possible to eliminate them with proper quarantining.......but I may change my mind later, depending what my experiences show. My one big hope, though, is that the quarantine experience is not worse than the ich for the fish - doing my best to make that a reality...

 

The problem is a healthy fish will show no signs of ich. It doesn't mean it doesn't have it, just its immune system is keeping it in check. So it will look fine in the QT, but can still be caring the parasite, then when you move to the DT, walla ich is in that system. I have never QT a fish either, ich comes and it goes. Its part of saltwater tanks. And in my humble opinion the whole QT process adds even more stress to the fish, which can increase the chance of a bad outbreak.

Edit: sorry got a little off topic. I have used copper safe, and had good results with that. You might want to look into that.

 

Not to be belligerent, but how can the parasite survive the copper treatment? I thought that after several weeks of treatment the parasite is eradicated until re-introduced from another site. I would think this was especially true since the fish are stressed by being in the QT. So if they show no ich there, they should be cured of it, no?

 

What your doing is a HT. Hospital Tank to treat the fish, this is different then a QT. A QT is used to observe new fish when you first get them. Basically the same tank, just two different uses. I have used an HT to treat. I was just discussing the whole QT thingy.

Edit: Also on a side note. Copper is a very effective treatment for ich, but should be used as a last resort. You can look in any of the ich post and see that you should soak food in garlic and or vitamins first and see if the fish can kick it on there own. Remember copper is toxic, there are a lot of debates on the long term affects on fish.

 

What fish species have the problem with the ? If it is truly simple garden variety Ich then it will always be around , Proper feeding and steady water parameters and proper parameters will do more then any treatments to keep the parasite at bey. Tangs , Angels and Butterflies suffer a lot more then most other speicies and tangs being the leader . Since people tend to allow the water parameters to fall off and rush to put them in a newer tank they stress and then Ich appears . Its nothing more then a common cold to use . I found that warmer temps elevated oxygen levels and pristine water parameters are the best cure and preventive .

Now the down side of copper is the heavy metal attacks the fish's internal organs aswell can do some real damage long term with Liver and kidneys and such . I have never had a out break that a steady 82F water temp and lowered lighting and higher 02 saturation levels fould not cure over a few days and with every out break the last new or weakened fish to suffer the problem simply builds up a stronger immunity to them through a healthy mucus skin coating .

Reef fish need water parmeters as good as corals woul really . Fis can adapt to lesser quality water but they for long term health should never be forced to . How old is your system ?

The Knee jerk panic reactions to cure often kills more fish then the parasite does its self ..