Alk/PH Question

Discussion in 'General Reef Topics' started by Jason McKenzie, Apr 20, 2003.

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  1. Jason McKenzie

    Jason McKenzie Super Moderator

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    So my Alk and PH are running very low. It has been like this for some time. But I wanted to read up on the relationship and effects before I proceeded with just buffering until the numbers were right. [glow=red, 2, 300]But[/glow] I don't think I'm any closer to knowing the answers to my questions. Everything I read give me chemical formulas and too indepth information.
    There is a vital relationship between Alk, Cal, and PH. To my understanding Alk is the waters ability to carry minerals such as Cal? (question) so with out high ALK nothing can absorb Cal and the Cal level in the water will remain high?

    This is the limited info or missinfo I have been able to extract. A simplifyed document or link would be great.

    Also if Alk is low how fast could I rase it
    Currently sitting @ 5dKh

    Thanks in advance
    J :-[
     
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  3. Wrassman

    Wrassman Peppermint Shrimp

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  4. Wrassman

    Wrassman Peppermint Shrimp

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  5. Jason McKenzie

    Jason McKenzie Super Moderator

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    Thanks Wrassman. I've got alot more reading to do.


    J
     
  6. JohnO

    JohnO Moderator

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    Hi Jakets,

    Heres what I have learned.

    Alk and Calc want to use the same space available in water and therfore must be added slowly and apart from each other.

    Alkalinity is a measure of the waters ability to resist the change in PH towards the acidic side and has nothing to do with the PH itself, It is just a measure of the buffering ability of the water.

    Alk and Calc will fight each other for the available "space" in the water structure so there is no use in just plonking in a heap of buffer ( alk ) together with a heap of calcium supplement as they cannot co-exist together immediately and you will end up with a snow storm in your tank ( happened to me )

    Magnesium is the other player in this as the Mag helps Alk and Calc work together.

    My advice is to firstly put your PH kit away as it is not needed.

    Raise your Alk to at least 10 dKH over one week. Then raise your magnesium levels to about 1200-1400 ppm ( epsom salts will do it fine )

    Test for Calc and start to raise to a target of about 400ppm.

    Do this slowly ( daily doses are fine ) and check the Alk every day, if it drops increase it again and dont add Calc that day. This might mean alternate doses of Alk and Calc on a daily basis but once you get to the levels as above it is just a simple tweek rather than a massive change.

    Hope that helps

    John
     
  7. Wrassman

    Wrassman Peppermint Shrimp

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    [glow=Teal, 2, 100%]Hey jakets,

    JohnO is certainly correct in what he says, my only caveat to all this would be to say, be careful as to what Ca you use. If you use simply Calcium Chloride (another form of salt), it is not going to be as available to the needs of the critters in the tank as if you used combinations of Ca.

    He is also correct about Magnesium being the "go between" here. It is true that Mg helps keep Ca and Alk in balance. As for working #'s in levels of Mg, I simply shoot for 3x Ca.

    Please check the labels of the additives. What you are trying to do is raise the Ca in you tank over the long haul, which means the Ca (and Mg) should ideally be used by the fish and corals in the tank. If it is in the form of carbonate or bicarbonate that will help a lot; if it is in the form of FOOD, that would be ideal.

    Please read your labels.
    [/glow] [smiley=book2.gif] [smiley=computer.gif] [smiley=scholar.gif] [smiley=thumbs_up1.gif]
     
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  9. JohnO

    JohnO Moderator

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    Wrassman,

    The article that helped me the most, because it was aimed at people like me who are chemically impaired ;D
    is http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm

    It shows a great chart which makes it easy to decide whether you need to attend to Alk or Calc. Check out the graphs you will se what I mean, I have one pinned on my wall for reference at all times

    John
     
  10. Wrassman

    Wrassman Peppermint Shrimp

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    [glow=Maroon, 2, 100%]Great article, JohnO!! That is one of my favorites too, and I had forgotten all about it. Thanks for bringing it to our attention!!![/glow] ;D