ich from corals?

luvdadoctors · 01-08-2006, 06:07 PM

Recently I had a death in the family, my newest member an Atlantic Blue Tang. A few days ago I noticed a few spots of ich on the fish. Two questions. Could ich be the reason for the death so soon? I only noticed it a couple of days ago. Next question is where did it come from? I suppose it could have come with the fish, but I've also added a few frags since then. Can ich be transfered on coral? Any info would be a big help.
Thanks,
The New Guy

blue · 01-09-2006, 02:24 PM

First thing - make sure it's ich. Send us a photo of the white spots. They look like little salt spots. Second thing - do you have any other fish in the tank? If you want to save them - you must get them out of the tank! Even one or two spots is really bad!!! Learn about the lifecycle of ich - it drops to the bottom of the tank and the population of ich explodes and all other fish in the tank will eventually die. If you are lazy and don't want to take the fish out or can't get them out - at least purchase a UV filter (but this may not work in time). The corals and any other invert (snails, cleaner shrimp etc) will not get ich, but all fish get ich. FYI - Usually it's not the corals themselves that bring the ich into the tank - it's the water that the coral comes with that could have ich (Ich can live in water without a host fish for over a month). Most corals have to remain under water during all tank transfers so usually some of the water from the original tank (where you bought the coral) must get into your tank during tank transfers. It IS somewhat unusual for this to happen because most stores are VERY CAREFUL with the coral tanks to avoid ich. I always make sure to purchase coral from a store that I trust!!! I never buy anything living online - I always check out the store tanks and figure out how they add little creatures to a tank before I make a coral purchase. Most stores after they get a shipment will hold the coral in a spare tank along with some fish for about a month or two - if the fish don't get ich in about a month or so - we can be PRETTY sure that no ich is in the water (never 100% sure but that's the best we can do) - then they do the coral transfer to the main coral tank. Ich's a huge problem so everyone tries to avoid it because it's really tough to cure. My advise - don't be lazy if you have any little fish in your tank that you want to keep alive. You'll need to take your entire tank apart so you can catch/net all the fish and transfer them to a sick tank. Let me know your tank specs (i.e. water parameters, tank setup and creatures) so I can help and send pics.

kb.bear · 01-09-2006, 09:07 PM

A little more info would be great
Don't panic
tangs are famous for getting ick
especially a new one because they get stressed in shipping
All tanks have a level of parasites that ill and stressed fish can get
What ever you do... if you have a reef or plan to have a reef DO NOT ren to your LFS and buy an ick med, most are NOT reef save Even some that do say reef safe can be risky. Anything that contains copper is BAD

Not to step on your toes blue I believe that there may be some fallacies in your statement about corals needing to stay under water during transfer, I often take corals out of the tank to frag them and glue them and move them from a prop tank to a display tank

I am not familiar with any Atlantic tangs If you meant Pacific blue tang then they are almost guaranteed to get ink from shipping and quite a few reputable fish stores automatically quarantine them and treat them with copper

luvdadoctors · 01-10-2006, 05:42 PM

thanks for the info. I don't have a sick tank yet and I don't think that taking apart the tank now is going to happen. I haven't noitced any spots on any of the other fish that I have ie. sixline wrasse, pair of percula's, and a royal gramma. The tank size is 45 gallons with a 8 gallon refuge. My water quality right now is close to perfect, no ammonia no nitrites ph 8.4 S.G. 1.024 nitrate is the only thing a little high somewhere around 15ppm. I had only had the fish for a few days. The morning of the death I noticed that the fish wasn't eating like it would in the past, and I did a scheduled water change with ro water that day soon after the tang showed some signs of being stressed so I turned my day light off. A couple of hours later he was gone. The store that I get my fish from is very reputable and has been in business for 15 or so years. They had only had the fish for less than a week, so it's possible he was sick to begin with and hadn't shown any signs yet. I have heard of a product called "kick ich" that is supposed to be ok for reef tanks, but dosn't promise results 100% of the time. So for now I think that I'm going to add some kick ich just as a precaution. Let me know what you think, and any other steps I may take. Also any help on lowering nitrates would be great. I have nitrate sponge in the refuge, and sufficent alge growth, but still can't reduce the levels.
Thanks again,
Dave

Jason McKenzie · 01-10-2006, 06:17 PM

Hey Dave,
Sorry for your loss. You know the fish had a pretty horrible trip before it got into your tank. So I'm sure your LFS and you did everything you could. But some times it just happens.

I've used Kick Ick before and honestly I don't think it did much. I wouldn't say it's throwing your money away but I had a Tank that would get ick if you looked at it, whether I was adding Kick Ick or not. The only thing that finally stopped the Ick was a copper bath.
But I understand the pains of trying to catch fish in a reef tank.

I would just wait it out and try another Tang in a couple of months.

J

blue · 01-11-2006, 06:55 PM

Well - If it were me I'd take the fish out today. They might live if you leave them alone. I just wouldn't take the chance. It will probably take over a couple of weeks for any signs on the other fish. I wouldn't treat with Kick Ich either (but then again I've never tried it - because I just don't trust it). I've been successful treating one of my fish about a year ago in low salinity 1.010SG (for about a month) and adding Melafix after the second week for seven days. Lower the salinity over the entire day. Low salinity kills the ich in the water - but not the fish. Melafix prevents the fish from getting a bacterial infection once the little buggers drop off of them.

My advice - take the fish out now and treat them separate. Never add any new fish to your display tank w/o at least a 1 month quarantine.

Good Luck!

Bruce · 01-11-2006, 07:06 PM

well, i know how the tangs can be...i had a regal tang and it got ich on and off for about a month before it died...never went to any of my other fish....now heres my understanding...and if anyone else knows im wrong tell me plz...wha i have heard is that ich will and always be in a aquarium...the only time that if effects the fish is when they are stressed out...this is when the ich has the chance to attatch ... thats what i think i would leave the fish alone...maybe try some garlic paste, there is usually some at the lfs (not real garlic...hmm never thought of that but...lol) trying to make a sick tank in a day or 2 will only kill the fish...plus the move will stress them out

Covey · 01-11-2006, 09:07 PM

The life cycle is too short for there to always be ich present. My Coral Beauty had it off and on for more than a month when I got it. It went away on its own. Heathily fish in healthy tanks rarely get sick. Of the fish you have left they are all pretty bomb proof. I would keep an eye on it but not tear the tank apart.

Let the tank finish cycling. Do you have a sandbed and if so how deep? Nitrate reducing sandbeds are easiest way to get rid of nitrate. You can use Amquel Plus and water changes if it gets out of hand before the sandbed starts working

The Alantic Blue Tang gets well over a foot long as an adult and really didn't belong in a 45G tank. That could have stessed the fish quite a bit as is. Tangs need swimming room. I would not add any more fish.

luvdadoctors · 01-12-2006, 07:50 PM

Well I've been loving all the advise that I've been getting. I've also talked to the owner of my LFS who's been an owner, and in maintenance for the last 15 years. When he speaks I listen. From what I understand ich is always in the tank good call Bruce. Not trying to step on toes, but even though their life cycle is short protozoans do multiply. He also told me that if the fish don't show any more signs of ich don't do anything. Just ride it out. I do agree that me tearing down my tank stirring up the substrate netting fish and moving them into a tank that doesn't have the exact same water quality when subject them to more stress that is necessary, causing them to drop their slime coat and consequently becoming more prone to ich. Here we are at square one again. Since the mishap I've seen no more signs of ich, and it would apear that my cleaner shrimp are helping with that. But still as a precaution I'm going to add some Kick Ich. It's completely copper free and reef safe. It's a 15 day program that is supposed to interupt the life cycle of ich. So I'm going to give it a whirl, and will keep everyone updated. Keep your finger's crossed for me.

Bluelagoon8 · 01-26-2006, 06:59 AM

Hi, you can use medicated feeds.

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