refugium + bioballs

[keats]

Hi all
Can someone please enlighten me on this
when you have a refugium sump tank is this to to replace your bioball
filter sump or do you run both.
I think the refugium replaces the bioball system but of all the threads ive read none really say so,
If it is a replacement can some one please point me to a thread that explains how it actually works and how long to establish and the best design.

From what i have read and guessed i believe
the refugium replaces the bioball sys
with the vegitation life consuming the excess nutrients.

One other thing
I've read about when using refugium a plenum you should be used with a deap sand bed to allow protected area for worm and other life.
when this sys is used is it used like the under gravel filter with power heads drawing current through the sand bed
cause i believe it would be going against the refugium way of thinking.

I could be way of track
still reading asking & learning
thanks for any help

[njdevilsfan]

keep reading it only gets harder

[coral reefer]

The refugium can be a very versatile and important addition to the symetrical balance of a reef tank especially! It houses a diverse population of bacteria, food sources such as pods, micro-invertebrates, macroalgae, small shrimp, snails, crabs, worms, fry and other microscopic organisms!
How you set it up and the size of the refugium is up to you...with benefits evident with any refugium set-up.
I don't like the bioball addition as they are good to a point until the balls get accumulated with detritus etc. causing the rise in nitrates-leading to but not limited to the growth of unwanted microalgae! Having to periodically clean these ball to rid the pollutants and detritus from accumulating on these balls is a pain in my opinion, when you can get better and a more natural result by implimenting live sand and rock to the refugium/sump!!!!!!!
This is just my opinion so take it for what its worth but, I have been doing this type of set-up for years while eliminating bioballs from my tanks overall function with great results!

[reef_guru]

there are different filtration methods and a refugium is one of them. general rule of thumb for flow: refugium slow, wet/dry from tank, sump depends on the system. some systems combine the sump with the refugium, imop they should be seperate.

[Tangster]

Originally Posted by reef_guru

there are different filtration methods and a refugium is one of them. general rule of thumb for flow: refugium slow, wet/dry from tank, sump depends on the system. some systems combine the sump with the refugium, imop they should be seperate.

I'm with you on this why limit yourself ? A shallow sand bed in the main tank and lots of Rock then a refugium with 5 inched and its beneficial and safe DSB or better yet a plenum in the refugrugium is great and the only place I'd add either. And as for the Bio towers ?I set them up like a refugium in a remote container and I run a good stream over and through them and I have never saw or had a issue with nitrates.

All this Nitrate mess started with the Dr when he was selling his theories .. and thats all the DSB was designed to do reduce nitrates and sell books and sand . And like my Carbon and PO4's reactors as with my coil denitrater I just flow a very small amount of water through the bio balls and I can double my fish and animal loads .. Unlike with a stand alone DSB . See I have the best of all worlds and no no3's My dissolved O'2 content its aways at the max. Hence better tang health as we have never had a problem keeping hard to keep fish.(: But the fact that wet dry has any NO'3 proves its doing what it should thats always been my knock on a DSB as a stand alone system why ??? I have a DSB, Berlin and wet/dry system (: But its healthy and requires little effort or worry on my part

[keats]

Hi again
More questions ????
Can someone please tell me if i'm on the right track with the mixing bioballs and refugium system.
From what i have read the refugium is designed to eliminate the bioball/canister/undergravel systems which create unwanted nitrate which then has to be maintained with water changes.

And that the live rock in tank and refugium and a good protein skimmer will prevent this naturally
and you need green plant seaweed in the refugium is to eliminate the phosphate.

Not 100% sure the reasoning for the deep sand bed in the refugium other than for the life you can culture in it does it actually have a purpose. EG: reduce nitrane or amonia

I know you can add a lot more but am under the belief the above would be all that absolutly nesessary.

Still reading and getting more confused
Thanks Steve

[smallcrpt]

I thought I was on the right track at one point or another, but I've taken the tangster route... slow slow flow over a seperate refugium that overflows into a seperate sump that returns to the tank.
I'm still in the learning stages as well, but I have less time to read because I can't set up the tank because i'm finising the basement so i can set up the tank...
good luck
-chris

[lunatik_69]

I think that reef-guru is somewhat right. I'm having a problem with no3(20 ppm) and I've tried almost everything. My bioballs are a mixture of some older ones(from my other system) and some new ones that were bought when I changed from my other smaller tank. I know some ppl dont think that 20 ppm is a big deal, but I have two goni's that won't open up and I would like to have the no3 lower.
I have cleaned out the balls already, about 3 times already. Should I replace the balls with new ones? Should I change all the bio balls at once or little by little? I still have a wet/dry system. What do you guys think. Luna

[Hoverman]

Originally Posted by lunatik_69

I think that reef-guru is somewhat right. I'm having a problem with no3(20 ppm) and I've tried almost everything. My bioballs are a mixture of some older ones(from my other system) and some new ones that were bought when I changed from my other smaller tank. I know some ppl dont think that 20 ppm is a big deal, but I have two goni's that won't open up and I would like to have the no3 lower.
I have cleaned out the balls already, about 3 times already. Should I replace the balls with new ones? Should I change all the bio balls at once or little by little? I still have a wet/dry system. What do you guys think. Luna

if you change out all the b/balls at once you will go through a full blown cycle again, if you change out half you will go through a smaller cycle but still a cycle none the less.

[keats]

Hi
??
If a refugium/protein skimmer with live rock is set up as a stand alone filter sys
and no biological filter system used will you still have the system go through some kind of new tank cycle.
also what is the best weed to place in a refugium
Thanks .