Suggestions for next purchase

Mr._Bond · 11-10-2004, 08:30 AM

Now that my nitrate issue from a couple weeks back is under control, I'm thinking of making another purchase for the tank. 3 options: 1. More live rock, I know that I'm supposed to have more for the size tank I have, but how important is that? 2. More "cleaning crew". With 2 shrimp and 2 snails and 1 urchin, probably not much of a cleanup crew, but I don't have much fish. 3. More fish. This is what I'd like, but want to do it right.
Can anyone give me any thoughts on what might be the next best purchase to keep my tank running smoothly? If you think it should be cleaning or fish, can you give any thoughts on specific cleaners and/or fish that'd be good for my tank? Was thinking of a Royal Gramma or an Angelfish for fish additions. Thoughts?

Birdlady · 11-10-2004, 08:46 AM

Well, you shouldn't really add uncured LR to a tank with animals in it. The LR is the basis for the biological fitration that takes place in your tank. (conversion from nitrates to nitrogen gas being the last step) So are you prepared to cure LR in a separate container for a few weeks? If not, I would add more LR, perhaps a little at a time since you have critters already. Also, the more LR you have, your system will be more able to handle a bioload (added over time of course)

(can you see where this is going???

)

Clean up crew you can add as you find need.

Fish, I am outta my league now. I do believe some Angels get very large, and some may nip at corals...

Matt Rogers · 11-10-2004, 08:58 AM

Ditto.

Yeah Angels are not good starter fish (How old is this tank?). They are very sensitive. Is this for the same tank with the clowns? Royal Gramma is a good choice.

Mr._Bond · 11-10-2004, 11:48 AM

So, the LR would be the best choice if I can cure it or if I get it cured? I was thinking more LR would probably be the wisest choice before adding more bio load, but would like more fish (especially since my clowns seem to have chosen a corner and won't leave it so 90% of the tank is in essence empty). The current LR was from an existing tank and the entire system is about 4 months old now. You think with the 30 - 35 lbs of LR I have, it could handle another fish or 2? Forgot to mention I'm being given a green chromise. How would a royal gramma be with that combo?

amcarrig · 11-10-2004, 12:18 PM

If you already have live rock in the tank, I don't see a need to buy more. Save some money and buy base rock at your lfs if they sell it or at www.hi-rocks.com. You can buy additional cleanup critters with the money that you save

The chromis and gramma should get along fine with each other and with most other "non-aggressive" fish.

Birdlady · 11-10-2004, 03:19 PM

Great Idea! I never even thought about adding base rock! I almost ordered my rock from Hirocks.com but ended up getting a deal elsewhere.

If you do that, there will be no die off and no need to worry about a cycle .... it will take a little time but eventually it would all be live

JohnO · 11-10-2004, 07:29 PM

[quote author=Mr._Bond link=board=Newbie;num=1100115031;start=0#3 date=11/10/04 at 14:48:01] You think with the 30 - 35 lbs of LR I have, it could handle another fish or 2? [/quote]

Despite what is considered 'Conventional ' wisdom, the amount of 'live' rock you have in a tank has nothing to do with the amount of fish you can keep alive :-)

One simple cup of sand has more than enough surface area to house the bacteria need to maintain the Nitrogen cycle in a normal sized tank.

Bacterial levels will simply rise and fall depending on the amount of food. A tank virtually full of live rock will eventually have the same amount of bacteria as one that has that cup of sand I wrote about above. The only reason you might want more rock is purely an aesthetic one, or maybe to get the surprise of some new critters or coral.

Either way just keep your fish additiions gradual and you shouldn't have a problem. OH, and not too many fish either :-)

John

Birdlady · 11-10-2004, 07:39 PM

Question, then , JohnO....I thought you could get nitrate converting bacteria deeper in the anaerobic zones of the rock that you cannot get with sand unless you have a deep sandbed...no?

JohnO · 11-10-2004, 08:07 PM

Sue,

You are 100% correct, the bacteria that covert Nitrate to Nitrogen gas live in an anaeobic environment, which can include inside rock ( regardless of whether it is purchased as ' live ' rock or dead rock )

The problem this type of bacteria faces is it's requirement for an oxygen free environment, it can only live deep within the rock and therefore can only get it's food ( Nitrate ) from the very small interface between it's environment and the 'outside' world. There is normally no circulation inside the rock except for the minute water movements the bacteria itself makes, so the conversion factor is quite small and the bacteria never really get to the number required to convert all of the Nitrate.

The theory with a DSB is that you do get an oxygen free environment for the bacteria but you also get a whole menagerie of small animals like worms who constantly dig minute tunnels and therefore supply the anerobic bacteria with new water to convert. This was the whole basis of why a DSB was such a wonderful idea :-)

However, it didnt quite turn out that way for everyone, including the man who supported it so passionately ín the first place and tanks started to crash for many reasons that I wont go into here :-)

I hope that helps :-)

John