Question on Bio Wheels

JPfish · 07-10-2002, 05:50 PM

I'm starting out a 55 Gallon tank which was previously freshwater with an Emperor 400 filter which has 2 bio wheels. Being new to the hobby, I've been relying on advise from a couple saltwater shops in town. One told me two leave the bio wheels which will help cycle my tank with all that previous bacteria from my Oscar dwelling freshwater tank, and the other shop told me to remove the bio wheels since the live rock that I will add will provide all the biological filtration I need. However I seem inclined to keep the bio wheels since they are part of the filter. Please help! ???

Matt Rogers · 07-11-2002, 05:50 AM

Welcome aboard JPfish!

The answer to your question kinda depends on what you are plannning to do. If you are going to have mainly a fish tank with some live rock, then I would be inclined to keep those wheels until you get a wet/dry which works on the same concept as the wheels, but is more effecient. But, if you plan on having a reef tank with a lot of live rock, say 1-2 pounds per gallon, then the one store is right and you won't need those wheels.

So to give you a straight answer is hard not knowing what your plan is about the tank and what other filters (skimmer?) you are getting or have already.

Let me know and I or somebody else here could help you out a little better.

matt

JPfish · 07-11-2002, 10:14 AM

Thanks! I am planning on getting enough live rock as to not overload the system (how much would that be?) and I am planning on adding corals, anemonoes, and having maybe around 5 fish, clowns, yellow tang and others. I'll be installing a protein skimmer this weekend and adding the water (acquired at fish shop) as well as Instant Ocean salt before adding the substrate which will consist of 1/2 Carib Sea Live Sand and 1/2 regular fine crushed coral. Once I have the water and salt going, the guy at the more trusted shop told me to run the Emperor filter(without cartridges) & my Rio 1400 powerhead on the bottom of the tank and and my protein skimmer for a few days to make sure all the salt has been well dissolved. At this point I'm to add my substrate and around 4 weeks later I'm to add my live rock. This is my game plan so far, please advise if I'm on the right track as I'm a BEGINNER! THANKS! please remember this is for a 55 Gallon setup! oh_no

Matt Rogers · 07-11-2002, 10:38 AM

That route will work. If you are comfortable with it, go for it.

Some comments on what you said though:

- why crushed coral? cheap? most people don't use that stuff anymore and just stick with aragonite sand. Crushed coral is often referred to as a 'detris trap.'

-it is hard to 'overload' a system with live rock. I think the most harm it could do is reduce circulation. stack it in such a way that it is not a solid wall. most people go with 1-2 pounds per gallon. i lean towards two. read step 2 for my rec's on rock.

I am partial to pre-mixing the water prior to adding it to the tank. I would buy those big ass plastic gallon trash cans and do it in those. Let them sit for a couple days with an airstone and / or a pump. Then use the pump with some hose to add to the tank. I actually recommend adding the sand first then the water. Many don't, but I think you reduce the mess this way. Use a plate or a bowl on top of the sand and add water onto that to reduce splash and disturbing the sand.

This is just my way. With patience, either way can have the same result.

Do you have a sump on this setup?
Are you using R.O. water?
-keeping many of specimens you mentioned will be dicey with tap water.

Good luck!
:thumbsup:

matt

Matt Rogers · 07-11-2002, 10:42 AM

Oh I forgot,

you can cycle a tank with the live rock, you don't have to wait four weeks to add it. most of the stuff on it will live or rebound. if you have some really show pieces that you don't want to take a hit at all, you can add those later.

you are not really cycling much with just sand and water. you know what i mean?

JPfish · 07-11-2002, 11:27 AM

Yes I'll be using RO water.

Do I need a sump for this set-up? It was my understanding that my Emperor 400 Power Filter and a protein skimmer with a couple Rio 1400 pwerheads would be enough. Please let me know if I'm missing something!

Thanks

Matt Rogers · 07-11-2002, 11:41 AM

Sumps are nice for putting your hardware in (and keeping them out of your tank!) but not necessary.

With quality rock in the amount I mentioned and a good skimmer you should be fine.

The bio-wheel is good at reducing ammonia and nitrite, but like a normal wet/dry, it doesn't break down nitrate. If you get enough rock, it would be possible to remove the wheels and just use it for circulation and leave the carbon or filter floss in it for polishing the water.

If you have trouble with nitrates, remove the wheels and see if they go down.

JPfish · 07-11-2002, 12:04 PM

Last question on the Bio-Wheels, please remember that these wheels have existing bacteria on them from my previous freshwater tank with a large Oscar!, even though I always conducted regular water changes and kept the water clean, could this be a problem or a blessing?

r_i_p

Matt Rogers · 07-11-2002, 12:12 PM

Heh. Well I think that bacteria is toast.

Since it seems you shut down your fresh tank a while ago, that bacteria is long gone.

I am not 100% sure, but I think it wouldn't deal with salt too well anyway.

It shouldn't hurt it though.

karlas · 07-21-2002, 11:19 AM

hi jpfish for the substrate you would be better off going with all sand you can mix your ls with dry sand. the dry sand can be bought pretty cheap especially if you live near a home depot. its called south down play sand and it is a pure aragonite. if mixed with ls all of it will eventually become live.

i have an emporer 400 on a 75 gall tank and what i did i ran it with filters and biowheels until the sb got established then slowly removed them 1 at a time. i do use the media cartridges to run carbon in the system but no filters or wheels now. with enough lr and ls this will serve as your main filtration but the emporer serves well as circulation on the surface wich will increase the oxygen into the water which is a good thing. as far as bacteria fw and sw are different and 1 will not survive in the other. keep your wheels though it may be a good idea just to hang on to them

1-2 lbs/gall is what is reccomended for lr and ls about 1lb/gal or a 4" sb. for pwr heads you may want 2 or 3 because you want to make sure you have enough circulation throuout the tank and no dead spots. also corals and anemones need good ciruclation to survive along with good lighting.

with an empty tank you can mix the salt in the tank but after adding livestock mix your change water seperatly in a bucket or big plastic container. with livestock if you add salt directly to the tank the salt may burn their skin. its best to mix it at least 24 hrs before adding to the tank also an airstone or small pwr head will help with mixing and adding oxygen to the water before adding

i agree with cycling the tank with lr or you could use table shrimp to cycle then add your lr. some people use damsels to cycle but it is becoming unpopular because cycling with fish is very stressful and most die from this. no sense of killing or injuring a fish if you dont have to

with some of the things you mentioed that you want to keep need a well established aquarium. tangs should only be put in one 6 mths or more they are very sensitiv to ick and changes in water quality can cause this to break out. also this is a good idea with a lot of corals mainly water quality issues. a new tank will go through many changes and alge blooms in the first 6 months or so that they may not be able to survive. and anemones are the big ones i reccomend at least a tank of a year old for these. they are very difficult to keep in captivity and need perfect water conditions to survive, a lot of them have very poor survival rates in captivity to begin with but can live hundreds of years in the wild. also i reccomend doing research on anything before buying. with out knowing what your gettin into can end up costing u big $$$ HTH