DIY ick medicine

[Tangster]

Originally Posted by trying it again

The last couple days I,ve been using Malachite Green with elevated water temps,plus GarlicExtreme and Zoe as a food soak.

Finding Dimethyl glycol so far isn,t going too easy, but that mix will be the next shot at it.

Then comes the, empty the tank scenario and QT the fish..after the holidays

Are you sure its a case of simple old garden variety ich aka Cryptocaryon irritans .. This pest is always laying in wait for a stressed fish with a hole in its armor or slime coat are the dots about the size of a grain of table salt or sugar or pin head ? that just showed up on the flanks ? Thats Ich and it in its self seldom kills as some local experts would have you to believe (:

But That having been said (: I'd ask Do you notice any I forget terminology now but any labored breathing of setting in front of a strong flow of water and just swimming up and down in a corner of the tank where water current is pretty stung ? And notice a white hazy looking small I mean small white to yellowish dusting of specks that seemed to start around the gills of the fish and head and move back along the flanks ? If so That's not Ick or Cryptocaryon irritans But Amyloodinium ocellatum aka marine velvet or coral reef disease
This is a fast and true killer ..
That starts inside in the organs of the fish liver Kidneys and moves out along the gills where the blood is closer to the surface and as part of its life cycle it moves outside the host to drop off and start the cycle all over again..And strong treatment is needed asap.. You have to know the disease before you can get to work trying to hold it at bay.. I use Tetracycline as a first line of defense on the Amyloodinium.. Heat will relieve the stress on the animals as mid 80s are their natural preferred tempatures in nature .. But some experts no better I guess ? if its Ich lessen the animals stress I'll cut the light for a few day and take the temps to 83 or 85 to speed the life cycling process of the Cryptocaryon irritans and build up the fish's immunity and slime coat.

And last but not least it could be a little diddy called Lymphocystis is frequently mistaken for Cryptocaryon or ich. But Lymphocystis is a virus rather than a parasite. A verey often made mistake I have myself been confused with this one. may want to look around to find what you are dealing with I hope to get a medial issue section on our site over the winter that deals with how to cure the problem once the problem is propely diagnosed and not assumed and or treated for what its not. Experience has taught me lot more then reading the musings of experts LOL

[charlesr1958]

Thats the thing though, 80 or 81 is not an elevated temperature. It might be higher than what you normaly run a tank at, but its not elevated in regards as to what this parasite finds suitable to live in. What you are most likely attributing to temperature is simply the fish developing a partial immunity to the parasite yet they will persist in your aquarium. Should your tank have a stress event, the fish can quickly lose that immunity and the ich hits them full force.
Experience means nothing if what you are observing leads you to the wrong conclusions. Learn the parasites life cycle and the biology behind what is actualy happening and I won't have to dispute you.

Chuck

[trying it again]

It seems that the fish look the best in the morning and the dots show up more in the evening with the most on the butterflies.

Smaller than a grain of salt, but not much smaller

[Tangster]

Originally Posted by charlesr1958

Thats the thing though, 80 or 81 is not an elevated temperature. It might be higher than what you normaly run a tank at, but its not elevated in regards as to what this parasite finds suitable to live in. What you are most likely attributing to temperature is simply the fish developing a partial immunity to the parasite yet they will persist in your aquarium. Should your tank have a stress event, the fish can quickly lose that immunity and the ich hits them full force.
Experience means nothing if what you are observing leads you to the wrong conclusions. Learn the parasites life cycle and the biology behind what is actualy happening and I won't have to dispute you.

Chuck

I totally understand the cycle of the pest and I think you are somewhat confused in the diagnoses of them..And as for what you consider elevated or not I would not tell anyone to raise there water above 82 maybe 83 as the oxygen is quickly depleted . But seeing how 85 86 is the average temp of the reef these animals come from Then hey go for it you tell them to elevate the heat.. I'd hate to see them kill their tanks like a few experts I know killed there 's (: Cryptocaryon starts in the first lays of the flesh hence the welts and bumps.. It unlike odenium that you have it confused with that starts with in the fish's body and move to the gills .. Experience may suit many others in learning the differences between the problems . I say what I say from my own experience and experiences and not parroting some mess I've read, I guess its up to the person who they would consider as someone they would take advice from ..

[Tangster]

Originally Posted by trying it again

It seems that the fish look the best in the morning and the dots show up more in the evening with the most on the butterflies.

Smaller than a grain of salt, but not much smaller

There is a tough strain of Cryptocaryon that is going around. What I have found to work well with it is the use of is Quinine Sulfate.. Its very effective on it.. I do think you have simple old marine ich or Cryptocaryon. Fish will build up n immunity with ever bout of this pest.. Might want to leave lights off for a few day's.. That will relieve the stress factor and have you tried the Tetra medicated flaks or pellets ? And you can dose the system with some Maracyn 1 if you notice any cloudiness in the eyes or red areas in the gills thats what will get them the secondary infection. I have seen powder blues and many other types to take months to get totally over the bumps.. As I mentioned with every out break they will build up a little more immunity.. As long as you keep them eating its most times they will slough off on their own.

[charlesr1958]

Sure, raising your tank's temp will most likely be harmfull, simply because any occupants have adapted to the lower temps and need to be acclimated over quite a long time to get back to the temps their metabolisms have evolved for.
As for Ich, if parroting this informaton is somehow wrong, then I'm guilty. Sorry, but i find it incredible that you promote basicaly doing nothing against this parasite other than creating the same conditions that they come from and ignoring them as if they will just go away. Its not all that difficult to prevent infestations from happening in the first place (quarantine maybe?) and / or treating to be rid of it.

cryptocaryon irritans - Google Scholar

Chuck